Rodgers - MVP

Dubz41 said:
Good point TW! I would give a lot of consideration to Carr and Stafford. Neither of those teams would be even close to where they are without their QB's play this year. IMO.
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Stafford has kind of gone into the tank the last few weeks so that kills his chances. Carr has played well but last couple games he struggled also. Most of the voters look how you finished not how you started.
 
Packinatl - I don't think anyone has said throw out the Brady season and give Rodgers a pass. You're trying to simplify, and make a case for someone without actually using facts.

Fact #1 - Brady was suspended for four games for violation of the rules. He essentially hurt his team by not playing fair. There are no bonus points for being a cheat, or letting down your team, because of it. His suspension was no different than a person caught using drugs. You don't give awards for being a cheat, and that's exactly what Brady was.

Fact #2 - The Patriots went 3-1 in his absence. You can play the; "Yeah but they didn't play good teams" card if you want, but it don't float. They were 3-1, that's what counts. Look at that across the entire season, and you see them being a potential 12-4, maybe better, or worse. It doesn't matter. They won games without him, and that means as great as he's played, they could get along without him over periods of time, with someone who isn't even NFL material at QB. Garoppolo isn't.

So, regardless of what arguments you want to make about how great the guy is, the team is special, and that is more important than Brady himself. They'll plug another guy into that system if Brady goes down next year, and still be competitive.

Now, let's compare that to other QBs, and their teams. Measure their potential success without their QB, with someone else at the helm.

The Lions, without Stafford would be horrible. Probably as bad as the Bears. The Packers without Rodgers would be as bad as the Bears. The Cowboys without Dak Prescott would still be competitive, because they have talent beyond him. That brings up Ezekiel Elliott who has been just as instrumental in the rise of the Cowboys as Prescott. Co-MVP? Same team? Not happening! Co-Rookie of the year in my book, but not MVP.

Next, I look at Matt Ryan and realize that his body of work includes throwing 2 or more TD passes to 10 guys over the course of this year, and 13 in total. That is a huge figure. Our own Aaron Rodgers, known to spread the ball around, has only thrown TDs to 9 players, and only 5 have two or more. Ryan's work, across the board, is a lot like that Rodgers had, in winning the MVP himself. Give credit To Devonta Freeman for helping to make Ryan as good as he is. Freeman can rip off some big runs, and is always a threat to go all the way. When Coleman is healthy, he too can be that good. The Falcons are 10-5, and a solid team. That's something in Ryan's corner for a lot of voters. They don't see the Falcons as that good, but they are, because of their running and passing attacks both being strong.

When you start to think about all of this, and the fact that Rodgers has a banged up team, our running game has been essentially non-existent except for a couple of games, and we're looking at just about everything happening because Rodgers has thrown the ball well enough to put them in a position to make the playoffs. In all honesty, could Prescott, Brady, Ryan, or Stafford, have done the same thing as the QB of the Green Bay Packers, and could each of those indicated slipped into anyone else's shoes and done as well as they did.

Although I know he won't get the MVP award, I believe that Aaron Rodgers has probably done more to keep the Packers in the hunt for the playoffs than any other QB has done for their team, in the league. Yet, he won't win the MVP, because it will go to either Ryan or Prescott, because too many voters don't truly understand what the award should represent.

Please notice I left Elliott out of the mix, because he's not a QB, and they'll usually find a way to give it to them.

Just my opinion.
 
Rodgers 2014 MVP season

16 games 65.6% comp percentage 4,381 yards 38 TDs 5 INTs sacked 28 times rating of 112.2

Rodgers 2016 season

15 games 65.6% comp percentage 4,128 yards 36 TDs 7 INTs sacked 34 times rating of 102.7

So very comparable seasons when he last won the MVP.
 
Packinatl said:
This is the part of the discussion I don't get. And I know I'm in the minority.
When this team was headed to 6-10 there was no hope and McCarthy was on the hot seat Now this team is on a roll it's because of Rodgers. Is it possible McCarthy reeled him in a bit and he's taking what is there. Who knows. But it's more than Rodgers. Nelson is more like the old nelson. More fluid on breaks. Adams is more consistent yeah he's dropped a few but it happens. Montgomery as a rb has worked. Even though McCarthy got chastised for it earlier. Talent will win in this league 85%of the time. This team did not quit.
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And because the team didn't fold like a beach chair is one reason why MM is a better coach than a lot of us give him credit for. I was vocal about letting him go earlier this season but the way the team stuck to gether IMO this is one of his better coaching jobs (2013 was another). Looking back I don't think his job was ever in jeopardy.
 
rpiotr01 said:
But Pack this is just falling down the old rabbit hole here. Why should Brady ever get an MVP when BB is the best coach of this generation and a dynamo judge of talent? Why did Cam deserve it last year for throwing bombs off play action while his front sat in max protect, and a stud D took care of business on the other side of the ball? Why did AR deserve it in 2011 when he had legit 6 receiving threats all over the field? Football is a team game. When it comes to W/L it never is and never was just about one player. In that sense why give individual awards at all? But if you're going to, look at the players who have risen above or really elevated their game. Yes Jordy came around. Yes MM kept the room together and got creative with Montgomery. But AR has been better than all of them, which is why he's in the convo at all. If Brady hadn't missed 4 games he'd have it locked up. Who else really stands out? Elliot and Ryan, sure. But look at the last RB to win - it was AP almost breaking the single season record. Elliot hasn't been at that level. I don't watch enough Falcons to know how great Ryan has been.
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There might be 2 strikes against Brady. #1 he sat out the first 4 games and #2 they went 3-1 without him.
 
Mark87 said:
I was just using Brady as a name... IMHO Dak Prescott would be the guy who carried his team all season from Game 1.
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Of course Dallas has a great rookie RB so that might take votes away from Prescott.
 
Mark87 said:
Does Tony Romo win that many games with that OL/RB ?...answer is no. Bottom line you can't do away with Rodgers 5-6 game slump and still call him the MVP at this point. Ryan is an interesting choice...I could see that too.
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Ryan has been great all season and he would be my choice if I had a vote. Rodgers did play pretty well in a couple of those games in that losing streak when our defense was dreadful but those loses will hurt AR's chances unless he plays at a ridiculous level Sunday night in prime time.
 
GBP4EVER said:
Rodgers 2014 MVP season

16 games 65.6% comp percentage 4,381 yards 38 TDs 5 INTs sacked 28 times rating of 112.2

Rodgers 2016 season

15 games 65.6% comp percentage 4,128 yards 36 TDs 7 INTs sacked 34 times rating of 102.7

So very comparable seasons when he last won the MVP.
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Man, we are so darn lucky. IMO Rodgers is the best QB in the league today and will go down as one of the greatest to ever play. Many will say Brady is the best but that team has won without him even before this season. IMO Brady is the most successful QB in league history. He has won damn near everything a guy could but I don't think he is the complete package like Rodgers is. Can you imagine what Aaron could have done in NE all these years? Shocked(
 
TW said:
Packinatl - I don't think anyone has said throw out the Brady season and give Rodgers a pass. You're trying to simplify, and make a case for someone without actually using facts.

Fact #1 - Brady was suspended for four games for violation of the rules. He essentially hurt his team by not playing fair. There are no bonus points for being a cheat, or letting down your team, because of it. His suspension was no different than a person caught using drugs. You don't give awards for being a cheat, and that's exactly what Brady was.

Fact #2 - The Patriots went 3-1 in his absence. You can play the; "Yeah but they didn't play good teams" card if you want, but it don't float. They were 3-1, that's what counts. Look at that across the entire season, and you see them being a potential 12-4, maybe better, or worse. It doesn't matter. They won games without him, and that means as great as he's played, they could get along without him over periods of time, with someone who isn't even NFL material at QB. Garoppolo isn't.

So, regardless of what arguments you want to make about how great the guy is, the team is special, and that is more important than Brady himself. They'll plug another guy into that system if Brady goes down next year, and still be competitive.

Now, let's compare that to other QBs, and their teams. Measure their potential success without their QB, with someone else at the helm.

The Lions, without Stafford would be horrible. Probably as bad as the Bears. The Packers without Rodgers would be as bad as the Bears. The Cowboys without Dak Prescott would still be competitive, because they have talent beyond him. That brings up Ezekiel Elliott who has been just as instrumental in the rise of the Cowboys as Prescott. Co-MVP? Same team? Not happening! Co-Rookie of the year in my book, but not MVP.

Next, I look at Matt Ryan and realize that his body of work includes throwing 2 or more TD passes to 10 guys over the course of this year, and 13 in total. That is a huge figure. Our own Aaron Rodgers, known to spread the ball around, has only thrown TDs to 9 players, and only 5 have two or more. Ryan's work, across the board, is a lot like that Rodgers had, in winning the MVP himself. Give credit To Devonta Freeman for helping to make Ryan as good as he is. Freeman can rip off some big runs, and is always a threat to go all the way. When Coleman is healthy, he too can be that good. The Falcons are 10-5, and a solid team. That's something in Ryan's corner for a lot of voters. They don't see the Falcons as that good, but they are, because of their running and passing attacks both being strong.

When you start to think about all of this, and the fact that Rodgers has a banged up team, our running game has been essentially non-existent except for a couple of games, and we're looking at just about everything happening because Rodgers has thrown the ball well enough to put them in a position to make the playoffs. In all honesty, could Prescott, Brady, Ryan, or Stafford, have done the same thing as the QB of the Green Bay Packers, and could each of those indicated slipped into anyone else's shoes and done as well as they did.

Although I know he won't get the MVP award, I believe that Aaron Rodgers has probably done more to keep the Packers in the hunt for the playoffs than any other QB has done for their team, in the league. Yet, he won't win the MVP, because it will go to either Ryan or Prescott, because too many voters don't truly understand what the award should represent.

Please notice I left Elliott out of the mix, because he's not a QB, and they'll usually find a way to give it to them.

Just my opinion.
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Fact #1.
Read the Wells report on Brady re: evidence. Oh there was none. I digress

My point was if a guy was injured and out 4 games it's not even an argument. This New England team may be the least talented in the last 5-6 years. Brady did anothave that 5 game slump Rodgers did. I'll say my case one last time. It's the body of work on the field over a season. Not a a stretch of games. That's why they don't hand out mid year awards.
 
Aaron was having issues with timing and fundamentals early in the year. I was starting to doubt him.
Having said that, I think if Adams catches the 3 TDs the last 2 games AR might have the MVP.
He would have 39 TDs and 7 INTs going into Detroit. That means most likely he would have had 41 or more TDs. Now he probably wont get to 40 since he only has 36. 40 TDs is a big number, especially when no other QB will hit that.
 
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