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Bud, I believe it's because we've enjoyed such a high level of success for so long at the hardest position to play.
Post Game: Ravens blank Green Bay 23-0
- Thread starter Mark87
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Vikings fans have been hateful towards the Packers since the day they came into the league. I've attributed it to a lack of understanding of games not played on a sheet of ice.
Down here, in the RGV, shuffleboard is big. We have 24 sheets at our park, and they hold tournaments regularly. The only people that really play the game are Canadians and people from Minnesota. They become a little uptight when I refer to it as "concrete curling." They think I'm talking down on the sport. Admittedly, they're probably right.
I like to play a game with these fans. I ask them who's starting at QB in the next game, or which WR do they think will have the best game the following weekend? Who's going to return punts this weekend? What's the name of your kicker? I forgot your punter's name?......
They stammer around and haven't got a clue as to who any of these guys are. You could tell 25% of them that Fran Tarkenton has come out of retirement to play QB, and they'd shake their head, and believe you. I know this for a fact. I actually pulled that one on a guy at a flea market down here. A real football fan he was. A Vikings fan. He said; "That should get them back on a winning track!" He didn't even realize they were in first place in the division. You just smile, and forget the conversation took place.
Now, on expectations from a 5th round pick. If you picked him, and you anointed him your backup QB, you had some expectations he could at least be a decent enough player to not be a boat anchor on the field. If you didn't believe in him, why in hell would you pick him? Nobody left? No free agents that could possibly be better? The fact is, it probably has to do with Thompson and McCarthy discussing the guy and determining he has skills that make it possible to groom him as a backup. Problem is, most people felt that what we saw in college was exactly what we'd get in the pros, except the game being faster would expose his weaknesses even more, and he'd fail. Laying this all on Thompson might be nice on a clinical basis, but I know better. McCarthy and the scouting staff have input on who Thompson ends up drafting. I don't see Thompson sitting in a room alone, on draft day, barking out orders over a phone, as to who goes now, and then. I see a large group of people sharing information, and a decision being made based on all their input, and knowledge.
So, yes. You can expect more from a 5th rounder. You can also expect less. I've seen first round picks tank, and never make it. I've seen 17th rounders like Starr end up in the HOF. I certainly haven't seen anything, including in preseason, that told me Hundley would succeed. His glossy stats weren't impressive to me. But, what I saw from Hill & Callahan was their resilience, and the fact that they improved their play. Hundley has never shown that ability, in my mind.
Down here, in the RGV, shuffleboard is big. We have 24 sheets at our park, and they hold tournaments regularly. The only people that really play the game are Canadians and people from Minnesota. They become a little uptight when I refer to it as "concrete curling." They think I'm talking down on the sport. Admittedly, they're probably right.
I like to play a game with these fans. I ask them who's starting at QB in the next game, or which WR do they think will have the best game the following weekend? Who's going to return punts this weekend? What's the name of your kicker? I forgot your punter's name?......
They stammer around and haven't got a clue as to who any of these guys are. You could tell 25% of them that Fran Tarkenton has come out of retirement to play QB, and they'd shake their head, and believe you. I know this for a fact. I actually pulled that one on a guy at a flea market down here. A real football fan he was. A Vikings fan. He said; "That should get them back on a winning track!" He didn't even realize they were in first place in the division. You just smile, and forget the conversation took place.
Now, on expectations from a 5th round pick. If you picked him, and you anointed him your backup QB, you had some expectations he could at least be a decent enough player to not be a boat anchor on the field. If you didn't believe in him, why in hell would you pick him? Nobody left? No free agents that could possibly be better? The fact is, it probably has to do with Thompson and McCarthy discussing the guy and determining he has skills that make it possible to groom him as a backup. Problem is, most people felt that what we saw in college was exactly what we'd get in the pros, except the game being faster would expose his weaknesses even more, and he'd fail. Laying this all on Thompson might be nice on a clinical basis, but I know better. McCarthy and the scouting staff have input on who Thompson ends up drafting. I don't see Thompson sitting in a room alone, on draft day, barking out orders over a phone, as to who goes now, and then. I see a large group of people sharing information, and a decision being made based on all their input, and knowledge.
So, yes. You can expect more from a 5th rounder. You can also expect less. I've seen first round picks tank, and never make it. I've seen 17th rounders like Starr end up in the HOF. I certainly haven't seen anything, including in preseason, that told me Hundley would succeed. His glossy stats weren't impressive to me. But, what I saw from Hill & Callahan was their resilience, and the fact that they improved their play. Hundley has never shown that ability, in my mind.
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Please stop. Playing shuffleboard with old people from Minnesota living in Texas does NOT give you an exclusive 'handle' on the typical Viking fan, c'mon.
Also, referring to Bart Starr as a 17th round pick is comparing apples to oranges and you know it.
Bart was the 200th player drafted in an age where a lot of players just went to work normal jobs. Hundley was the 147th player drafted in his draft class. I think MM thought he could coach BH up, but it turns out he couldn't. How high of a draft pick would you be willing to spend on a back up QB?
Also, referring to Bart Starr as a 17th round pick is comparing apples to oranges and you know it.
Bart was the 200th player drafted in an age where a lot of players just went to work normal jobs. Hundley was the 147th player drafted in his draft class. I think MM thought he could coach BH up, but it turns out he couldn't. How high of a draft pick would you be willing to spend on a back up QB?
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Just using metaphoric license to create an image of Vikings fans that we can enjoy on a cool winter evening.
You're right on comparison. Can't compare the two drafts, or players. Completely different eras.
How high of a pick would I use for a backup? The rule of thumb around the NFL is that you have a journeyman backup who may have traveled a bit. He's good enough to be a caretaker, not a starter. You then keep a 3rd QB on the roster who you don't have to include in the 47 man list on game day. He's the "emergency QB." Hundley doesn't fit into either of those categories to be honest, because he lacks the ability to take care of the football. A 5th round pick being a project as the #3 is fine, but you don't put this guy in a position he can't handle as the #1 back up. You're just playing with fire, and it backfired on the Packers, and a lot of us warned it very well could this year with the changeovers on the offensive line.
As far as who is better, Hill and Callahan both were better in their own right, than Hundley. The only thing Hundley had over them was more knowledge of the playbook. But, in reality, as you watched them play, both Hill and Callahan had better field presence than Hundley. Yet, McCarthy made the choice, the season is destroyed, and the proof of how bad this team really is has raised it's ugly head.
What frustrates me most is that the Packers have refused to look at anyone else as a potential backup, off free agency. There has to be a lot of guys out there who are better than Hundley. The Packers won't even try anyone out.
Look at the records of all the back up QBs the Packers have used over the McCarthy years, and the one guy they refuse to call has the best record of all of them. I guess they don't even see how ignorant that looks.
Let's make something clear, it wasn't a secret Hundley had issues in the pocket and held the ball too long. It was a known he threw bad picks and would drift right or take off running when pressured.
It's the reason he's a 5th round pick, a bunch of people gave myself and PackinATL crap about it the last few yrs when we told you the man wasn't starting quality...
TT/MM are arrogant egotistical pricks that won't adjust their way of thinking. Hundley is just another in a long line of examples of that.
Dubz anything outside a 3rd in this day and age will never be an even quality backup. There are a handful of guys that can play in the NFL...the rest are a waste of roster space. ( The why's of that are for another post)
It's the reason he's a 5th round pick, a bunch of people gave myself and PackinATL crap about it the last few yrs when we told you the man wasn't starting quality...
TT/MM are arrogant egotistical pricks that won't adjust their way of thinking. Hundley is just another in a long line of examples of that.
Dubz anything outside a 3rd in this day and age will never be an even quality backup. There are a handful of guys that can play in the NFL...the rest are a waste of roster space. ( The why's of that are for another post)
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Sad thing is I doubt Packers give up on Hundley after this year they probably bring him back as backup in 2018 and just draft another QB in the 4th round or later to replace Hundley if they let him leave after next year. Packers have Rodgers so they are happy with having just a guy behind him. Thing is now is the time to start looking for the QB that will replace Rodgers.
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I'm just glad that others are being recognized for their prickish ways....